A World Where the South Turns Fascist (Southern Victory Part 3)

A World Where the South Turns Fascist (Southern Victory Part 3)

Well, that only took 2 months. Harry Turtledove’s Southern Victory series imagined a world where the American Civil war ended with the Confederate states of America becoming its own independent nation. The end to one conflict, however, is merely the start of a century of hatred between the two former allies. It’s a century that spans over 9 books, and in the case of this YouTube series, four parts. In this video series, Emperor Tiger Star and I are focusing on the world and history that Turtledove crafted, Timeline 191. Alliances are shifted and victories are changed simply because the South is now a force to be reckoned with. These videos are meant for those who are interested in the scenario, but don’t want to go through the novels themselves. They aren’t summaries of character motivations or plot by plot details, Just the simple big history of events that transpired and why they transpired. But hey, perhaps after listening to this you want to get into the books as a result. Who knows? The two past videos part one and two go into detail on what exactly happened. However to catch everyone up. here is a brief summary of what occurred in the sixty years since the south was victorious. The South Won the American Civil War back in the 1860s; an invasion of the North by Robert E. Lee’s Forces was successful and it was a slap in the face to the Union cause, The Union was forced by the British and French to allow the Confederates to break away and the War ends in Southern Independence. This forever destroys the relationship Between the North and these two. A few decades later, the south tries to get mexican land. The U.S. Threatens war. Knowing there is no way they can win without these two helping, the south realizes It won’t get help without getting rid of slavery and so even though it goes against much of their code Slavery is officially disbanded and the south gets help. War breaks out the United States gains the German empire as a friend, But it doesn’t stop it from being beat yet again by the coalition. instead of the U.S. being united for a single alliance, It’s now split. the North aligns itself with the central powers against the british and French allied confederates. Surprise surprise, war breaks out yet again. World war one, the great war. In this alternate timeline, the war is also on the American Homeland. the North American front is just as brutal as the western and Eastern front’s of Europe. Union and Confederate forces Stalemate at the Mason-Dixon line as a hellscape of Trench warfare begins to take shape. Since the British are enemies, the U.S. invades the populated areas of Canada and Permanently occupies the territory. The war in Europe goes entirely different; the french mutiny and surrender. Custer who survived, introduces the first use of Tank warfare, or Barrel warfare, against the Confederate lines. While the front line collapsed, the oppressed blacks in the south had enough and rebelled against the Confederates. A Socialist Black Rebellion spread throughout the Mississippi Valley. Valuable resources are used to destroy the uprising, but it’s enough that the North can break through. The South is defeated, the British are defeated, WW1 ends with a Central Powers victory. Germany gains territory, the U.S. gains Kentucky, part of Texas, and Canada. So, I think we’re all caught up. It’s the 1920s, only a few years after the war. The South is now devastated by the loss of this. Feeling victorious by winning one out of three, the United States punishes the south for the war, pretty much just what happened in Germany.
War reparations, limit on military, you get the point. And just like in our Germany, being subject to humiliating defeat and punishment from your enemies doesn’t mend ties. The atmosphere in the 1920s North America is that there will be another conflict. It seems that the North and South are just destined to forever clash. However, as of now, the Confederates are too weak to do anything against the U.S. But one man is willing to change that. Even if that means he controls the Confederates himself, and his name was ADOLF-I mean, Jake Featherston. (Really should have been a better name. Oh well.) Jake Featherston served in the War against America, never being allowed to be promoted due to a grudge from the officers, he became bitter towards much of the authority from Southern higher-ups. The capitalists, aristocrats, officers, politicians, he wanted to wipe the slate clean. not only that, he blamed the socialist black rebels for stabbing the South in the back, and causing them to lose the war. Well luckily for him, He found a new ideology that embraced his hatred of everyone, but himself. The Nazi par- I mean, the FREEDOM party. Featherston had a knack for expressing his views and gained popularity for his rousing speeches against the blacks and Politicians who were destroying the confederacy. (I think you can see where this character arc is going.) The south losing the great war created the situation where a new authoritarian leader and ideology would rise to take over the Confederate States of America. Over the course of the 1920’s and 30’s, The Confederates see the freedom party in a far better light due to rousing speeches and economic decline. Basically a substitute for these guys, but what else was occurring while this guy was gaining popularity? The United States was dealing with its own ideological insurrection as well. Unlike our 1920’s, this U.S. wasn’t roaring, in fact, jobs were still difficult to come by and the poor were turning to more radical beliefs. Socialism wasn’t as hated in the U.S. as in our timeline. Instead, socialists began to win Major victories and elections, Becoming the new rivals to the democrats, who had sat pretty comfortably for decades, since the republican party had died. The author of The Jungle, Upton Sinclair, an avid socialist, which was what the book was meant to be about by the way, Ran for president against Teddy Roosevelt and won the election. Sinclair, trying to be peaceful, He eased reparations, allowing in the South to have a more favored view towards the north Well, this wouldn’t last for long. As we all ask in times like this, “What about Canada?” When Canada was annexed, The US allowed the French Canadians to form their own separate puppet state: Quebec. When this happened, the two countries joined the Quadruple powers which made up of Germany, Poland (a German puppet state), the United States, and Quebec (a U.S. puppet state). The best way to Illustrate the state of North America is a layered cake of tension Yeah, that’s not a stupid analogy at all. Canadians, who are occupied by Americans, hate the United States and long for the days of being British or Canadians or whatever quebec is this becomes such an issue that insurrections begin to erupt and even Assassination attempts on American leaders for decades there’s practically a secret war in Canada as rebels fight to maintain their identity Think of the United States as the black sheep of the English-speaking world While the confederates are allies to britain the u.s. Actively fights against it and sides with the Germans instead It’s a very strange dynamic as the Americans are increasingly isolated By people who speak their own language the British look at Protestant rebellions and just like the confederates long for the days where they were once the great power of the world and The French due to will count them in this just slowly building resentment the thing I love that turtledove Does is he includes single Fringe movement of our timeline? Into the narrative of this timeline the British politician Oswald Mosley in our timeline Ran a small group called the British Union of fascists they were promptly shut down once the war began however in Turtledoves world Mosley’s views are not only mainstream. They’re prominent He leads a group called the silver shirts which influenced the British Parliament into a hard-line stance in France They are simply done with democracy altogether the Republican experiment failed in the eyes of many Frenchmen in one group the acción Francois I’m terrible at French come to power to install their leader as the new French monarch Charles the Eleventh the 1930s begins with an age of economic turmoil it appears that radicalism has grown throughout the western world The only one is the Confederate states the stock market crashed Exploded the popularity of the freedom party in Jake Featherston as the new leader of the south in quick Secession featherston was voted into office Along with his party where they abolished the supreme court in voted to make Featherston effectively president for life The main Rhetoric featherston preached was he wanted the states back that the United States took during the war sinclair agreed to allow the people of the States of Houston Sequoia in Kentucky to vote in 1941 Well all the Sequoia voted to get back into the CSa the deal was the south when it demand anymore after this But this wasn’t enough for Featherston who demanded Sequoia back you see Featherston wanted Award No matter what it was something he had prepared for for decades and has allies across the see war as well there had to be a breaking point and there was Wilhelm II of Germany died and his son will home the third Refused to allow France its captured territory back for the New alliance This was enough to declare war Featherston set his sights on, Ohio Ohio was the Heartland of the us And if it was say successfully annexed the us would be split in half this planned invasion is called operation blackbeard in August 1941 the Confederates invaded the United States crossing the Ohio river in Into American territory in the span of a week they fought to lake Erie and the military presence that was there was entirely destroyed Featherston wasn’t too smart he planned that the yankees would surrender when they saw such an act of military incursion but the new President Al Smith Wasn’t too keen on being friendly to the south the Americans were ready for a fight in this time to end the confederate issue once in for all Featherston in the CSA effectively signed their death sentence with the invasion of Ohio And so world war two began the conflict would be even more devastating as the north and south Fight for the fourth and perhaps final time and that is where emperor tiger star comes in to finish off the series I? Think he’s been waiting too for a very very long time I could talk about this book all day, and there’s plenty of smaller details I’ve left out so if you want to read about how these events occur I seriously recommend these books spanning a century of alternate history So, what series do you want me to cover next? (If any) Tell me in the comments. This is Cody, of Alternate History Hub.

100 thoughts on “A World Where the South Turns Fascist (Southern Victory Part 3)

  1. Unfortunately, this is no longer alternate history. We are IN this timeline (of a fascist South) in 2019.

  2. Doesn't all of this overlook the lack of industrialization in south or the fact that the UK could get their cotton from Egypt and India

  3. Thats sort of stretch to be honest. The southern constitution was basically identical to the North's. Hitlarian ideas would have been cringy to the south as well.

  4. Socialist Black revolution sounds like something even today’s America will crush without second thought lol

  5. The South already went facist. Their desendants approved of oppression of Black people for political power. Their decendant spread over the US after the destruction of their home and spread the facism belief of oppression of Black people and Indian people. Those decendants are now MAGA supporters, who in polls would approve of some one wiping out democracy (Trump), and one man rule.

  6. I read this series long ago. I recall that about three-quarters of the way through, it seemed like Turtledove just didn't care anymore and started copy-n-pasting Eastern Front accounts but switching the USSR for the USA and Nazi Germany for the Confederacy. Kind of spoiled the series, IMO.

  7. Funny thing is the North was going to be facist but for some retarded reason he changed his mind and completely changed a character

  8. I thought this was supposed to be an alternate history what-if series?

    The South is Fascist. The difference is that it is a cross between German/Italian Fascism and ISIS Fascism (except Christian instead of Islam). Welcome to 2019.

  9. what would happen if slave owners turned fascist…

    Because slave owners are typically free love equality liberals.. ?

  10. You left out the expansion would not have happened for greed and the millions of Indians would not have been slaughtered. South had 6 tribes fight beside them, Lincoln said the enemy behind him was as real as one in front as he was against making South bleed and also expansionism into West and Indian lands. Thats why Freemasons including 6 of his cabinet arranged for JWB a patsy agent provocateur victim kill him. JWB did not die , many statements from army verify that and also they were threatened to stay silent or get firmest reprisals. On death beds they told all. Damn Yankees.

  11. Change the name of the Freedom Party to the Republican Party, and you have exactly what we have today. The South IS Fascist.

  12. The South was never going to turn fascist. It lacked the industrial-urban infrastructure that sustains totalitarian regimes.

  13. Where the south “turns” fascist? Turns? I’ve had the displeasure of living in the underbelly of the United States, let me assure you it is one red cloak away from the Handmaid’s Tale as it is. No turning necessary.

  14. Mosley entered politics out of a desire to end all wars. That he is painted here as some sort of a warmongering megalomaniac just bc he called himself “fascist”, when he was the only pacifist fascist, is ahistoric nonsense.

  15. You compare Feathersome to Hitler constantly, but was he actually similar in any way to him other than being an awful dictator? Was he actually both nationalist and socialist? Or just racist?

  16. 9:00 he mentions the stockmarket crash and I m all like:
    Wait a minute! Didnt you say that the roaring twenties werent a thing? How can there be an as devastating crash without a boom?!
    I know the fault lies with the author, taking certaint events for granted no matter how much he changes the timeline.

  17. I have not read the books. Sounds interesting.

    The only alternate history style books I've read, are the change series by sterling. Also Eric flint 1600's series.

  18. they gave some territory to the south so they wouldn't take anymore land.
    Sounds familiar….. cough sudetenland cough

  19. Any reason why the North (us), doesn't become a German speaking state,? I mean around the time of ww1 the US was almost 50% German background, (mainly in the North) and in this time line it'd probably be a lot more

  20. While it's not technically a series yet, I've already begun the second novel in a planned trilogy. My first book "The Hand of God" also deals with a Southern victory during the Civil War, but with a twist. Atomic energy has been developed much earlier than in our own timeline. At first, it merely takes the place of coal in steam-powered engines. Soon, however, the full implications of its potential are revealed, and the South starts putting together a crude atomic bomb, "The Hand of God", from which the novel takes its name. Available on Amazon.

  21. The South pretty much was already fascist. Mostly free speech was squelched when it was about the evils of slavery and nobody had any rights, except to be drafted into the Confederate Army. Then after the war there was a terror war on the former slaves much like the Nazis would terrorize the Jews before the decided on the final solution.

  22. It's been 2 years after this has been posted but I wanted to share something. The U.S became rich off of the Great War. American weapons and supplies sold to their European allies poised America as an economic super power after the war. World War 2 consolidates American dominance over the world as the period of Decolonization begins. Wouldn't the American economy not have grown so large if they had to fight such a brutal war in WW1?

  23. This may be an old video but as of right now this is possibly the only time I would support a complete Central Powers victory.

  24. Did You Just Say Adolf Hitler Well That's Not Gonna Happen My Man If Jake Featherston Died I Would Humbly Honored His Death And Continue His Legacy By Becoming The Leader Of Confederative Republic Of America I Would Humbly Continue His Legacy Long Live Confederative

  25. So, the whole point of the jungle was socialism? When I tried to bring this point up to my 8th grade history teacher, and she pushed it off.

  26. I swear I’ve heard this somewhere else before poor country becoming socialists that hate fascists and the fascists that hate the socialists invade thinking they would loose but get steamrolled sounds familiar

  27. If ww1 went mostly normal with a allied victory do you think that the confederacy would side with the nazis?

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